Re: Ross Stearn - is he right for Bath City?

by comrade powell Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:23 am

Now you're talking, Benny! In the long term Wilson may prove to be an effective addition to the squad, but there could well have been an opportunity to bring back Charlie instead of the mistaken belief that Reid would score goals. Those Charlie doubters only need to look at the impact he has made at Glos...

by Mcnulty Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:42 am

Ahh Charlie Griffin, not the most mobile or quickest of centre forwards but a born goalscorer. Shame we couldnt have retained him to complement the admittedl excellent strikers we brought in. Personally I'd have let Josh go and kept Charlie. Added bonus of confusing the opposition defenders by playing him and Pratty together, quite similar looking arent they? First few games this season i thought we still had Griffiin playing up front but that Adie had sent him to some sort of summer fitness camp!!
Seriously, Griffin would have relished playing alongside such hard working partners as Pratt and/or Watkins.

by Paul1978 Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:18 pm

ha ha ha. this debate is ridiculous. stearn could well be on twenty goals by now if he started more games. I think Liverpool should drop suarez, he is top scorer but has a terrible attitude. he bites people and is generally cocky. so what if stearn has attitude problem (this has not been proven so doubt its true), he knows where the net is, is exciting, raises the crows, even runs on the pitch after he has been subbed too celebrate goals. passion, skill, excitement. what fans want. cant believe this debate is still going on.

by comrade powell Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:47 pm

so why do you keep prolonging it?!! Laughing

by Paul1978 Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:50 pm

because im angry that people are making stupid posts about it. should suarez be dropped because of his attitude then powell ?

by comrade powell Fri Mar 28, 2014 1:21 pm

i could give a reasoned reply, but i'd clearly be wasting my time. if reading others' 'stupid' posts makes you so angry, why come on here? facebook is probably better for your health!

by BenE Fri Mar 28, 2014 1:49 pm

personally I enjoy Paul's contributions. long may they continue.

by comrade powell Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:52 pm

quite agree. with the world cup approaching, I look forward to our 2 yearly debate on england as a super power!

by Paul1978 Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:38 pm

I just cant see the logic behind him bursting the "bubble". when he ran on the pitch after being subbed against Chelmsford too celebrate with Pratt that proved too me he gets on with team mates. where did this myth come from. however if he did have a small attitude problem (and I don't think he does) why should he not start ! Paul Gascoigne luis suarez, diego maradona, wayne rooney, have massive attitude problems but are still the first names on the team sheets. I believe stearn is in the "bubble" though and doesn't have an attitude problem. he is our best player, top scorer, fast, skillfull, fans love him, he simply has too start when ever possible.

by Peteboa Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:54 pm

I agree Hilly.....I wander how many other clubs are debating whether their top scorer "is right for them"?! It's a peculiar one. I sometimes wander whether we should just recruit the most gentlemanly team, enter a church league, go for for the fair play award and celebrate with a prune juice and a game of marbles if we win it.

by yuffie Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:17 pm

i am not sure where the idea has come from that he is not playing because he has 'burst the bubble' - he has not played every game because he has not been consistent enough

to my mind only three players have played consistently well enough to warrant a guaranteed starting place this season - mellor, ball and watkins - perhaps you can add gallinagh as well - so it is no surprise that when fit they have always been in the starting xi

anyway, we're just going around in circles now - in a month or so we'll see which camp is 'right' when we find out which players the club wants to retain - and if he is one of them, whether he wants to stay

by Paul1978 Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:18 pm

Yes browner. does seam some fans think we are in a church league. this is football for christ sake. not tiddly winks. yuffie there have been posts about him being not in the bubble on the forum, I aint searching for them. how can our top scorer (from midfield) not be consistent ????? that would mean pratt and Watkins aren't consistent as they have scored fewer goals and should therefore be benched as well ! I would start all three for every match. there all class and we are blessed too have such good attacking players. they best all be offered deals. I can see us being top five next season.

by yuffie Fri Mar 28, 2014 7:39 pm

well, for what it's worth pratt has been benched a few times - and watkins brings a lot more to the team than his goals - he's the best all round centre-forward i've seen for us since scotty partridge

and also i don't really understand where church leagues and tiddly winks comes in when trying to defend him

by stillmanjunior Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:09 am

The idea that Stearn isn't popular amongst players is a total myth. He's organising their end of season holiday for goodness sake, if he was that bad they wouldn't bother going*

We've had players like him in the past who have proved they're not really more than impact players, such as Davidge and Morgan. I personally would rate Stearn a lot higher than both, but he still has his moments which can be infuriating. Not long after he came on as sub on Monday he took possibly the worst free-kick I've ever seen, absolutely ballooned the ball out of the ground from miles out, would have needed something incredible (even by his standards) to trouble the keeper. Stearn is hit and miss coming on as sub. He can make a difference (Whitehawk home, Gosport home in cup earlier this season) or be barely noticeable. Up until his red card I thought he was looking the real deal, he had a good run in the team then as well.

For what it's worth I just think we change the team too much sometimes. I didn't expect the same XI to start Saturday and Monday but it seemed whatever happened on Saturday the team for Monday was already decided, hence two players who scored in that game, and both played well, being benched. Burnell was brilliant against Dorchester and hasn't started a game since. Aaron Brown hadn't been in the reckoning at all then suddenly started on Monday night. You only have to look at the centre pages of the programme to see how much we've chopped and changed.

I'm just quite old-fashioned with how to line-up really. I prefer a predictable 4-4-2 where everyone knows their jobs, two out-and-out wingers who are naturally right and left footed. Ping crosses in from the bylines. Pace. We haven't had a proper left winger for ages, probably since McKeever? We seem to favour four more central players in midfield and rely on our full-backs to provide a lot of the service. Granted the two we usually use, Simpson and Ball, are superb footballers, but they can't do it all.

Gone off on a tangent a bit. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I'd much rather have Stearn playing for us than against, that's for sure. I would never go to a Meet the Manager again to find out the reasons (I have my reasons for that) and I do think the management are doing a decent job. I think we're doing about the best we can with our resources compared to others and thank God we're not one of these teams that decides to change manager at the drop of a hat. I don't see the harm in starting him for the final games now, we don't really have anything to play for. He might not make a difference at all but I think it's worth a shot.

* Cue them handcuffing him to a lamp post in Ibiza or nicking his passport

by Midsomer-steve Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:34 am

Brilliant stuff Pete and Paul - I'm with you 100%. I particularly like your belief Pete that our best chance of success is to play the players, at every opportunity, that score us goals; because although our defence is alright it is not very good so it is important to go into each game with that attacking flair in order to stand the best chance of scoring more goals than the opposition - like we did last Saturday but unlike what we have done too many times before. Would love to have a chat sometime to exchange views - my serious concerns from last year have not gone away - contrary to a few others I think we have underachieved this year if we don't finish in the top five.

Mark - I am impressed with your last posting - full of very good points/observations and opinion. Just one thing spoils it as it appears to fly in the face of the rest - "I do think that the management are doing a decent job", assuming you mean the team management.

by stillmanjunior Sat Mar 29, 2014 10:59 am

I just think it doesn't matter who is in charge. We had John Relish, won a trophy every season he was in charge and people moaned. I just think the best we could probably achieve at the moment is just outside the play-offs, which is where I think we will finish. If we had a season full of performances like Dover and Basingstoke home obviously I wouldn't be happy.

Arch hasn't been accepted from the second he was appointed by an unusually high percentage I would say. Even if we, by a miracle, won promotion this season, the second we are hammered by a side with more resources than us people will go mad.

by Midsomer-steve Mon Mar 31, 2014 2:53 am

stillmanjunior wrote:I just think it doesn't matter who is in charge. We had John Relish, won a trophy every season he was in charge and people moaned. I just think the best we could probably achieve at the moment is just outside the play-offs, which is where I think we will finish. If we had a season full of performances like Dover and Basingstoke home obviously I wouldn't be happy. I think your words "at the moment" are most pertinent. I agree that will most likely finish outside the play-offs now, but I cannot eliminate from my mind where we were placed just before we met Eastleigh in December, and then omitted our two highest scorers from the starting line-up in the next two matches. With half the season to go at that point we were full of optimism for a top five finish weren't we?

Arch hasn't been accepted from the second he was appointed by an unusually high percentage I would say. Even if we, by a miracle, won promotion this season, the second we are hammered by a side with more resources than us people will go mad. Well I wouldn't for a start. I would have been content to have earned another season in the Premier division, and then rewarding the same squad of players by letting them see what they can do at the next level - thereby not overspending horribly like we did before. (the increased gate money would hopefully take care of the extra 'running costs' involved). If they had not proved to be good enough, and we had subsequently been relegated, what would we have lost compared with biding our time in Skrill South until a windfall came our way? We could 'stand still' for ever! I would much rather we 'yo-yo' between the two divisions - it would be more exciting, and it would create more interest, both from paying customers and sponsorships I would hope. The point I am trying to make is that I believe we should be trying our utmost to get promoted, within budget, and with management that the fans can endear themselves to, by being convinced that their aim is the same. This is not happening - the inconsistency of the starting line-ups is baffling. Didn't Sat's line-up (the same as the previous Sat') prove something? I think we have a terrific squad of players which is worthy of a higher league placing than it is now going to get.

by 2weirdtown Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:48 pm

Midsomer-steve wrote:
stillmanjunior wrote:I just think it doesn't matter who is in charge. We had John Relish, won a trophy every season he was in charge and people moaned. I just think the best we could probably achieve at the moment is just outside the play-offs, which is where I think we will finish. If we had a season full of performances like Dover and Basingstoke home obviously I wouldn't be happy. I think your words "at the moment" are most pertinent. I agree that will most likely finish outside the play-offs now, but I cannot eliminate from my mind where we were placed just before we met Eastleigh in December, and then omitted our two highest scorers from the starting line-up in the next two matches. With half the season to go at that point we were full of optimism for a top five finish weren't we?

Arch hasn't been accepted from the second he was appointed by an unusually high percentage I would say. Even if we, by a miracle, won promotion this season, the second we are hammered by a side with more resources than us people will go mad. Well I wouldn't for a start. I would have been content to have earned another season in the Premier division, and then rewarding the same squad of players by letting them see what they can do at the next level - thereby not overspending horribly like we did before. (the increased gate money would hopefully take care of the extra 'running costs' involved). If they had not proved to be good enough, and we had subsequently been relegated, what would we have lost compared with biding our time in Skrill South until a windfall came our way? We could 'stand still' for ever! I would much rather we 'yo-yo' between the two divisions - it would be more exciting, and it would create more interest, both from paying customers and sponsorships I would hope. The point I am trying to make is that I believe we should be trying our utmost to get promoted, within budget, and with management that the fans can endear themselves to, by being convinced that their aim is the same. This is not happening - the inconsistency of the starting line-ups is baffling. Didn't Sat's line-up (the same as the previous Sat') prove something? I think we have a terrific squad of players which is worthy of a higher league placing than it is now going to get.

Amen to that especially the final sentence

by comrade powell Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:06 pm

actually it's the final sentence which i would take issue with. i know that steve is one of many who will blame the management for every failure and i too think they have been at fault over several key decisions. the biggest was last summer with their recruitment, which has led to an unbalanced squad and the constant need to bolster it with inadequate loan signings. i hope i'm wrong, but i expect to be moaning about the same thing again come xmas! but the players have to take some responsibility as well - too many inconsistent performances don't tend to lead to a table topping final position. so i would disagree that we have a 'terrific squad' (however, if we have, why the outbursts of anger when it is fully utilised? you can't have it both ways). yes, it would have been nice to reach the play offs again, but to see this squad starting in conf prem come august would probably signal a repeat of our last season there. no thanks! and is the club ready for the move up off the pitch, following the 2 disastrous years it has endured?

surely the way forward is the retention of most of the present squad and the recruitment of better players in key areas. if a couple of those can come from the under 21s, even better. a place in next year's play offs would then be a realistic target and a title winning side the season after. the club will hopefully be in a stronger position off the pitch by then and the prospect of being a well established one at the top level a more realistic one. i can remember a yo yo existence back in the 60s - it wasn't much fun....

by Midsomer-steve Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:08 pm

comrade powell wrote:actually it's the final sentence which i would take issue with. i know that steve is one of many who will blame the management for every failure and i too think they have been at fault over several key decisions. the biggest was last summer with their recruitment, which has led to an unbalanced squad and the constant need to bolster it with inadequate loan signings. i hope i'm wrong, but i expect to be moaning about the same thing again come xmas! but the players have to take some responsibility as well - too many inconsistent performances don't tend to lead to a table topping final position. so i would disagree that we have a 'terrific squad' (however, if we have, why the outbursts of anger when it is fully utilised? you can't have it both ways). yes, it would have been nice to reach the play offs again, but to see this squad starting in conf prem come august would probably signal a repeat of our last season there. no thanks! and is the club ready for the move up off the pitch, following the 2 disastrous years it has endured?

surely the way forward is the retention of most of the present squad and the recruitment of better players in key areas. if a couple of those can come from the under 21s, even better. a place in next year's play offs would then be a realistic target and a title winning side the season after. the club will hopefully be in a stronger position off the pitch by then and the prospect of being a well established one at the top level a more realistic one. i can remember a yo yo existence back in the 60s - it wasn't much fun....

May I just pick out a couple of things that Martin has said (highlighted in red). I don't feel there are outbursts of anger when there has been a concensus of opinion that we started with our best eleven - only cries of frustration and disappointment if we haven't won, which may, of course, be because some players had been off-colour. But when the concensus of opinion is one of bewilderment in the belief that we haven't started with our best eleven, and had subsequently not won, or even drawn, any anger is primarily because people feel that management has not given the team every chance of getting a good result. As for obtaining better players in key areas - that would cost money that we do not have; and my comments on letting the current squad sample life in the next division, through earning that right to do so by winning promotion, was an attempt to exist at whatever level is earned that way without breaking the bank. I believe that people do not want to watch their beloved City play with any hidden agenda pertaining to 'standing still' whilst waiting for a pot of gold to arrive at TP before the Club has any aspirations to move forward. It is a very difficult situation, but I bet you couldn't tell any one of those players not to try too hard until the Club is in the black. Even more importantly I don't think we have a snowball's chance in hell of increasing our fan base whilst there is any feeling 'that we don't want it'. We all basically want our team to win, and we want to be entertained - both are possible - the knock-on effect of either should increase our fan base. Therefore choose our best team every time - no shackles - and good luck to them. I'm sure that will reduce the acrimony - win, lose or draw.

by comrade powell Mon Mar 31, 2014 5:03 pm

i'm sure the management do pick what they consider to be the best team for each individual game. whether we like it or not, their opinion of who that 11 for a particular game is will be based on a host of reasons, many of which we will not be aware of. you talk of a best 11 - so they would be selected for every match, barring injury, irrespective of recent form, our opponents on the day, tactics, formation etc? that's not going to happen with any manager.

yes, i did say the recruitment of better players was needed in some positions, i didn't say more expensive ones. i wonder how much it would have cost the club to bring in someone with bowman's quality and potential? if we really want to see us become established as a top level club, i think the way forward is to gradually recruit players who will serve us for several years. in the past the answer has been ex pros in the twighlight of their careers - surely more expensive than developing young, local talent. but the latter needs patience - it's not a quick fix!

by Peteboa Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:15 pm

Yep, we have to believe that the management are picking what they believe to be the strongest team! A lot of fans would say that with such a limited squad, Howell's and Brittons' team selections have been pretty odd, or maybe we just don't appreciate what a footballing genius Howells really is. I doubt it. To me it's fairly obvious they have their favourites (gethin jones, Burnell) and those they are less keen on (Mohammed, Morgan, Stearn). You can see the type of player they favour... well drilled, professional, unassuming and restrained.

by comrade powell Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:32 pm

Some fans would say that those 4 adjectives are worthy qualities to have in your squad. Of course there's also a place for the genius who turns it on one game in five, but do you select him game after game ahead of others you have greater trust in? Presumably you would, but then you're not a manager...

And you disagree with Steve's comment that we have a terrific squad?

by yuffie Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:13 pm

whilst avoiding the bigger picture discussion here the idea that burnell (fewer starts and more times named a substitute than stearn) and mohamed (71 starts in under two seasons here and only dropped when he announced he was leaving at the end of the season) fall into the favourite/non-favourite category is slightly baffling

and the less said about your previously stated view on gethin jones the better

by Peteboa Tue Apr 01, 2014 1:07 am

"Some fans would say that those 4 adjectives are worthy qualities to have in your squad"

As one of those fans I agree! but none of them can compensate for raw ability, particularly in an attacking role!

Gethin Jones. Fantastic club servant and fits those 4 adjectives perfectly. Sadly, he was embarrassingly out of his depth at conference level and cost us numerous goals (yet continued to start) Sorry if that ruffles a few feathers but its true. Can you honestly say you think Gethin Jones should be a regular starter in a Conference Premier side, yet Stearn shouldn't be a regular starter for a team in the Conference South?!!! come on now.

Despite being out statted by Yuffie, the wider point remains....you only have to look at the personnel in our squad over the last few seasons to see which type of player the management clearly favour. That's not an outright attack on Howells and Britton, it's simply an obvious observation to make. They prefer a cautious approach.

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