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8 at home 11 away

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comrade powell
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Post by Paul1978 Wed Nov 22, 2023 6:27 pm

after farnborough game we will have played 8 at home and 11 away. yeovil will have played 11 at home and 7 away. home games are traditionally higher for average points gained. i know its not fact but we sure have played more away than them. they had maidstone fixture reversed as maidstone ground was being done up. our away count is higher than our home count due to yeovil and slough games being cancelled due to fa cup.
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Post by Paul1978 Wed Nov 22, 2023 10:16 pm

Sorry got the intell wrong. Just corrected green slime have played 11 at home and 7 away.
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Post by BenE Thu Nov 23, 2023 2:14 pm

Ah that makes more sense. We have won 5 at home drawn one and lost 2. Away we have won 5 drawn 4 lost 2. You could argue we have been better away from home. But overall we have been consistently good. Long may it continue.
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Post by comrade powell Thu Nov 23, 2023 3:37 pm

So our average points at home so far is 2.0 and away 1.6
Yeovil - 2.6 and 1.9

Predicted end of season table…

https://www.footballwebpages.co.uk/national-league-south/league-table/predicted

So in the playoffs semi we’ll be at home to winners of Aveley/Torquay. 
Sorted!
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Post by Luton Roman Thu Nov 23, 2023 3:50 pm

comrade powell wrote:So our average points at home so far is 2.0 and away 1.6
Yeovil - 2.6 and 1.9

Predicted end of season table…

https://www.footballwebpages.co.uk/national-league-south/league-table/predicted

So in the playoffs semi we’ll be at home to winners of Aveley/Torquay. 
Sorted!

2 points a game not enough to go up automatically !

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Post by comrade powell Thu Nov 23, 2023 4:59 pm

Far better to reward the second placed team for excellence over the whole season than give promotion to whoever wins two or three games after it has finished.
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Post by Paul1978 Thu Nov 23, 2023 7:29 pm

comrade powell wrote:So our average points at home so far is 2.0 and away 1.6
Yeovil - 2.6 and 1.9

ha ha ha. i wasn't saying these home and away stats in the hope we will win the title. Yeovil should win it with huge budget and full time status. were doing quite superb and i'm really enjoying the moment at the minute.
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Post by Paul1978 Thu Nov 23, 2023 7:31 pm

Luton Roman wrote:
2 points a game not enough to go up automatically !
it wasn't enough in 1990 when we didn't go up with 98 points. however in the summer we did go up as dovers ground was not up too GM Vauxhall Conference standard.
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Post by Paul1978 Sun Nov 26, 2023 5:33 pm

Hampton and Richmond, and Maidstone hardly played any home games. Also we've played more away. Yeovil lost 4 1 away to Welling yesterday. I really hope Yeovil bottle their 10 point lead.
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Post by Paul1978 Sun Nov 26, 2023 5:38 pm

comrade powell wrote:Far better to reward the second placed team for excellence over the whole season than give promotion to whoever wins two or three games after it has finished.
can understand your point powell but I prefer play offs. Keeps the season alive for more clubs and less dead rubbers at the end of the season. Also means higher attendances for clubs at end of the season for what could be dead rubber games. As long as football don't introduce the ridiculous rugby Premier league players off system.
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Post by comrade powell Sun Nov 26, 2023 8:40 pm

We’ll have to disagree. Apart from the nonsense in theory of a seventh placed team who finish way behind the runners up going up by winning three games on penalties, it means the season is over for most clubs before the end of April.
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Post by Paul1978 Sun Nov 26, 2023 9:38 pm

comrade powell wrote:We’ll have to disagree. Apart from the nonsense in theory of a seventh placed team who finish way behind the runners up going up by winning three games on penalties, it means the season is over for most clubs before the end of April.
we normally disagree powell but at least we both agree England are in the top 2 sides in Europe. Very Happy the play offs give hope to the mid table placed teams at the end of february that they can get in the play offs. increases attendances as the remaining games have something on them rather than mid table muck finish to end the season. I don't understand your bit about the season being over for most clubs by april, surely its the opposite as play offs give most teams hope of going up via play offs if mid table coming into last quarter of a season.
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Post by comrade powell Mon Nov 27, 2023 10:02 am

I meant that for all but seven clubs the season finishes on the last Saturday of April. I should have added that because of the need to finish the season so that the blessed playoffs can be staged before players’ contracts expire, we have so many midweek games scheduled and the season kicks off on the first Saturday of August - we started on 3/8 a couple of years ago when temperatures can be 25+. 
I think you’ll find that as we enter April every club is still playing for a promotion/playoff position or trying to avoid relegation. It’s only the last couple of games which can be dead rubbers for a few. Something we can check towards the end of this season. Reward excellence!
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Post by Paul1978 Mon Nov 27, 2023 8:04 pm

i like that teams are going for the play offs or scraping too survive in april. the whole league has competitive games till the seasons end. i hate dead rubbers. you prefer top 2 go up only? so most of the next 15 teams in the division will have many dead rubbers with no play offs. many a lower attendance for dead rubbers.
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Post by comrade powell Mon Nov 27, 2023 8:44 pm

So why do you dislike the system used in rugby?
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Post by Paul1978 Tue Nov 28, 2023 9:27 am

comrade powell wrote:So why do you dislike the system used in rugby?
because champions are champions. 1st team should definatley win it. the rest should go in europe. dont need place offs in top tier as no teams can go up. in football champions are champions at our level. teams 2 to 7 can battle it out for the other promotion spot. keeps the season alive till the end for at least 10 teams rather than being over in march. lots of better attendances for more clubs and more money desperately needed at our level. if a team is 15th in march they still got a chance of the play offs. rather than no hope of promotions. this team will definately have higher gates than if there was no play off system in place and they had no chance of getting in the top 7.
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Post by comrade powell Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:02 pm

Of course teams who are midtable in March probably still have a mathematical chance of reaching the playoffs but the last two seasons suggest this is wishful thinking. Last season the top seven in early March all finished there with exception of Havant (4th) being replaced in playoffs by St Albans (9th). (we were 12th and finished one place higher - I don't recall us getting into a frenzy over a playoffs place in those last two months).
The season before (21/22) it was a similar picture with 6th and 7th St Albans and Dulwich being replaced by 9th and 10th Eastbourne and Chippenham.
But I concede that some are taken in by the hype - out of interest how much do you think attendances are increased by the carrot of watching their team possibly reaching the playoffs in the last two months of the season?
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Post by Paul1978 Tue Nov 28, 2023 8:33 pm

i reckon its would put 200 on citys gate if we had a chance of making the play offs in march. some fans wont bother going if we are mid table muck.
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Post by comrade powell Wed Nov 29, 2023 1:53 pm

As the weather is so horrible today I thought I'd use my favourite football website to see if the facts agree with what you say above for last season!
https://www.footballwebpages.co.uk/national-league-south

Our attendances averaged 1122 over the 23 home fixtures. For the six home games in March/April the attendances were 92 above that on average and yet it was only for the last of those that we didn't have a mathematical chance of reaching the playoffs. And that was against Oxford which drew a crowd  of 1704, the second highest of the season!

I believe that our excellent attendances of the last few seasons are as much to do with the brilliant marketing job done by the Club as what happens on the pitch - our home record last season of 10-3-10 with only 33 goals scored bears that out.

You said above... if a team is 15th in march they still got a chance of the play offs. rather than no hope of promotions. this team will definately have higher gates than if there was no play off system in place and they had no chance of getting in the top 7.
The facts back you up but not as much as you might think. I took a look at the attendances for the last two months of last season of clubs finishing 2nd to 15th (only Dover and Welling were below 15th at the start of March and eventually finished in the top 15)...
For 2nd - 7th placed, attendances averaged 107 up on their season's average
8th - 11th (including us) 148
12th - 15th 26  

I think this shows that those clubs just outside the playoffs with two months to go can look forward to an increase but not as significant as you mentioned. For those in the bottom half of the table not so. As for those in the highest bracket I guess some will have high hopes of the title but Ebbsfleet were running away with it (15 points ahead of Dartford in early March)
Dartford's figures are interesting - their spring attendances were 93 down on their season average - presumably as they knew there was no chance of the title but they were virtually assured of a playoff place. 3rd place Oxford saw a similar decline. St Albans were the opposite with a jump of 428!

So while I agree with you that the chance of the playoffs does have a positive effect on attendances for the clubs just below the playoff places it actually leads to a feeling of 'dead matches' for some of the top clubs. Dartford lost two of their home games in that period and failed to win the home semi. They are just the latest example of the highest placed teams not doing well in playoffs and one of the reasons why I'm against them.
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Post by Paul1978 Wed Nov 29, 2023 6:18 pm

interesting stats powell, that must have took you ages.
my point isn't about teams who have already secured virtually in the play offs. they'd definately have a decrease as the non hardcore would wait for the play offs too return too a match. eg dartford. its about the teams from 15th to anyone who hasn't virtually secured a play off place increasing attendances for last bit of the season.
yes i think the increase in attendances is due too the marketing of the club, the 2 bars to drink on terraces and the football on show. a perfect combination for a decent average attendance. i wonder if there's an online poll for people for and against play offs.


Last edited by Paul1978 on Wed Nov 29, 2023 6:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Paul1978 Wed Nov 29, 2023 6:21 pm

comrade powell wrote:As the weather is so horrible today I thought I'd use my favourite football website to see if the facts agree with what you say above for last season!
https://www.footballwebpages.co.uk/national-league-south
good website powell but i wonder why most clubs have 1 or 2 attendances missing. ebbsfleet for example have n/a attendance for games against dover and eastbourne. do they average against 23 or 21 teams in this scenario.
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Post by Peter Newman Wed Nov 29, 2023 6:22 pm

Quite difficult to make comparisons as the latter months of the season may or may not include a team's more attractive/local games.
Also when comparing the attendances it should be between the run-in average versus the average upto that period.

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Post by comrade powell Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:25 pm

Paul1978 wrote:
comrade powell wrote:As the weather is so horrible today I thought I'd use my favourite football website to see if the facts agree with what you say above for last season!
https://www.footballwebpages.co.uk/national-league-south
good website powell but i wonder why most clubs have 1 or 2 attendances missing. ebbsfleet for example have n/a attendance for games against dover and eastbourne. do they average against 23 or 21 teams in this scenario.

If you click on the results tab rather than attendances I think you’ll find all the attendances. It’s a great website for stats at all levels from EPL down to level 8. And I like being able to look at previous seasons.
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Post by comrade powell Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:33 pm

Peter Newman wrote:Quite difficult to make comparisons as the latter months of the season may or may not include a team's more attractive/local games.
Also when comparing the attendances it should be between the run-in  average versus the average upto that period.

Re your first point, yes but then there are other factors - weather, matches with reduced prices etc. Both Taunton and Chippenham had a ridiculous number of home matches to fit in during those last two months which would presumably affect attendances. 
Re second point - yes agree - as it’s cold again tomorrow I’ll have another go! 👍
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Post by Peter Newman Wed Nov 29, 2023 10:35 pm

Please don't do it on my behalf!
I think  whatever the figures say the real conclusion would be " How long is a piece of string "

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